| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| kether |
Posted - 08/04/2006 : 18:30:26
I still don't get why my TMS journey has been so super-sized. I mean I KNOW I'm very sensitive, I've lost love ones, had break-ups, been a child of divorce etc... but no one beat the crap out of me or molested me. makes me wonder if my unconscious is hiding a BIG secret or something, since Sarno says the proportion of symptoms is equal to the repressed emotion. you would think I grew up in a war zone getting beaten daily. anyone else feel like their symptoms are worse & than their "emotional stuff". I'd really like to know...
thanx
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| 19 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Jim1999 |
Posted - 08/08/2006 : 22:59:26
quote:
Originally posted by Nor
Kether and Jim1999,
I applaud your efforts in spreading the word. I try to do it in small steps only with loved ones I assume are open-minded. I tried a few times to share Sarno's ideas w/a neighbor who has FM and she seemed open but it was almost as if I was speaking through her. She "yes'd" me all over and then proceeded to say something about her rheumatologist and not being able to tolerate dental work b/c the novacaine doesn't work if you have FM. My words went in one ear and out the other. She still suffers. I find myself avoiding her now b/c I feel the need to ask about her status. I really don't want to hear the response. I guess I'm still a work in progress but at least there is PROGRESS.
Nor,
Thanks for the compliment. I'm glad to hear that you are making an attempt to help others who are trapped in the TMS tar pits. I think that the more desparate people get, the more they are willing to give Dr. Sarno a chance. So, if you see your neighbor having more pain or moving more cautiously than usual, that might be a good time to take another shot at talking about Sarno.
As far as the chronic pain websites are concerned, I probably should point out that these places are not very good for TMS patients who struggle with their confidence in the TMS diagnosis. People on the chronic pain sites will try to talk you out of believing in Sarno. It's what they do. Talking to friends and relatives is certainly a better way to get starting in trying to help others.
Jim |
| miche |
Posted - 08/08/2006 : 22:30:14
I was so good as a child, never had to work at it either, so what bothered me the most was that it must have been appreciated but it was never acknowledged, a hug would have felt so good, let alone a kiss, the only compliment I ever remember getting was about my red hair, this was certainly none of my doing Maybe we don't resent being good so much as we resent the fact that it is expected of us . When my husband and I separated , my father was furious his reason being that both he and my mom had counted on us to take them in in their old age, my ex was the only French spealing son in law they had ( my parents could not speak English) so I went and spoiled it for them .I had been a very GOOD daughter my whole life but whatever I did was NEVER enough. Come to think of it this is what is most infuriating to me, I always seem to give everything one hundred percent but it is never enough , maybe in our goodism we get to be taken for granted |
| art |
Posted - 08/08/2006 : 17:42:38
quote:
Regarding the sensitivity issue - I think the whole topic is interesting and affirming. I'm also pretty sensitive and I agree about the dark side. We all have the beast in us and all that goodist crap comes to a head. We resent being good all the time. Pisses me off sometimes. Its liberating to acknowledge it.
This made me laugh. Exactly right. 
It pisses me off too.. |
| Nor |
Posted - 08/08/2006 : 11:58:36
Kether and Jim1999,
I applaud your efforts in spreading the word. I try to do it in small steps only with loved ones I assume are open-minded. I tried a few times to share Sarno's ideas w/a neighbor who has FM and she seemed open but it was almost as if I was speaking through her. She "yes'd" me all over and then proceeded to say something about her rheumatologist and not being able to tolerate dental work b/c the novacaine doesn't work if you have FM. My words went in one ear and out the other. She still suffers. I find myself avoiding her now b/c I feel the need to ask about her status. I really don't want to hear the response. I guess I'm still a work in progress but at least there is PROGRESS.
Regarding the sensitivity issue - I think the whole topic is interesting and affirming. I'm also pretty sensitive and I agree about the dark side. We all have the beast in us and all that goodist crap comes to a head. We resent being good all the time. Pisses me off sometimes. Its liberating to acknowledge it.
Nor |
| armchairlinguist |
Posted - 08/08/2006 : 10:51:20
About sensitivity: I was reading a chapter from Wherever You Go, There You Are where he talks about the earth suffering from the things we've done to it. It's not the main point of the chapter, but it really caught my heart and I looked out the window (I was on a plane) and suddenly comprehended what he was saying and it hurt my heart so much I started to cry, even though I was on a plane (very public place, I hate crying in public). I had never thought of it before as the earth itself suffering.
My mom, who I believe has super-TMS, is so sensitive she will not watch movies with much violence (no Lord of the Rings trilogy even). I have always found it a little odd. I think it is hard even for me (who's pretty sensitive) to relate to her more extreme sensitivity. But listening to you guys, I think now I will try harder to be understanding.
I do think our TMS is about how we react to things, and that that is just the way we are sometimes. I also think it is worth keeping in mind that there are some subtle but potentially very damaging child-raising attitudes that are not usually considered traumatic, but actually are, like undermining a child's self-esteem by having ridiculous expectations for his/her achievement (though this is becoming more known for its bad effects with the Pushy Parent stereotype, it can be carried out in much more subtle ways), or teasing a sensitive child about his/her sensitivity. We aren't often told that this behavior by our parents is not good for us, unlike outright abuse where it's generally more known that it's bad. (Not that that helps much, and I'm not in any way trying to diminish abuse or say that the above things are identical to it.) Anyway, we tend to grow up assuming that we had an okay childhood and not understanding that we are messed up by it or why. I know at least for me it was kind of a revelation to look at my childhood in this light (of having my self-esteem undermined by high expectations), and it allowed me to see that I was holding in a lot of unhappiness and a big sense of being unloved because I was mostly just praised when I did something good.
--
Wherever you go, there you are. |
| h2oskier25 |
Posted - 08/08/2006 : 07:46:35
Wow,
It's really nice to see I'm not the only over the edge animal lover. I once hit a large football player on the bum for beating on a Buffalo's cage (Colorado University has a Buffalo for a mascot) because he scared her. I knew he scared her because she jumped. I was like 110 pounds - football player 250 lbs.
I ran up to him, hit him on the bum with my fist and said "Stop that". We were both sort of surprised, but he got down from the railing and walked away.
I was shaking. I won't stand for cruelty. I don't think he was even aware he was scaring her.
I have to say, though, while I can't get too deep into the suffering of animals, and I give generously to causes I believe in, especially the David Sheldrick Wildlife Trust in Africa saving elephants, rhinos, and habitats in general, I am generally encouraged.
When I was a kid humanity seemed so insensitive to animals. Now, I see that societies general sensitivity toward animals is slowly increasing. Look at the following that PETA has, and they're pretty radical.
Is it enough? Never, in my book. I, too, can't bear to think about the drowned exhausted polar bears. What about the penguins? Oh god, don't get me started.
Hey, Singer_Artist, I had a Turtle when I was a kid, too. It was my first death, too. The similarities never stop . . .
I personally feel its my duty to be brave enough to "stomach" what I have to in order to help out the most. It's better that I witness the cruelty of some and get involved to help out those who can benefit from it now or in the future. I'm sure it's a TMS stressor. That's what crying is for.
You guys are all so cool for loving animals so much 
Beth |
| art |
Posted - 08/08/2006 : 06:04:04
Amazing....and nice....to find so many like minds...
Kether, are you my long lost sister or something
Ditto animal movies (Disney included), ditto getting put down, especially by my mother for being "too sensitive," and ditto the "growing pains." I used to lie awake at night in agony my legs would hurt so much...
But I wonder it there isn't a dark side to all this...What I mean is, we're all pretty quick to equate our sensitivity with a certain almost innate "goodness"....or in fairness, I am. I can't speak for anyone else...And of course by most standards we are good people, especially to the extent we identify empathy with goodness and "decency."
And yet at the same time, we're as human as human can be of course, with all the darker emotions and instincts our humanness implies..Especially if you're a Freudian, which Sarno is, to be human is to be locked in battle with a whole roiling cauldron of dark and nasty instincts, most unconscious, but not all...
For those of us overly invested in "being good" this can create an awful lot of conflict, some of which might very well contribute to our TMS...So come to think of it, maybe that's another answer for you Kether as to why your symptoms seem out of proportion to the bad stuff in your childhood...
JUst some thoughts, anyway.. |
| Tunza |
Posted - 08/08/2006 : 01:10:30
Sensitivity about suffering is a huge part of my TMS I am sure. And I am damn angry about people causing suffering too.
Worry about people (including myself) and animals being in situations where they suffer without hope is something that I try to push aside daily (ie repress it). I can't stand the thought that there are animals suffering during vivisection and abuse and people out there all over the planet suffering right now as I type. I mean you DO have to distract yourself otherwise you couldn't function.
I used to try and do my bit to help (even holding funerals for bees as a 10 year old) and then I became too overwhelmed to do anything other than donate money to good causes. Lately I have been wondering about volunteering at the humane shelter where we got our current dog and I think I just have to keep telling myself that this is enough.
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| Jim1999 |
Posted - 08/07/2006 : 22:39:31
quote:
Originally posted by Nor
Just curious, why do you and Jim still visit the fibro websites if you are convinced its TMS? Do you give others the info? If so, what is the response/reception to TMS ideas?
Yes, I visit fibro websites mainly to share my success with Dr. Sarno's ideas. I'm not there to seek other treatment options for myself.
The response is what you might expect from what Dr. Sarno says: only a small percentage of patients are willing to consider his ideas. I still think that it is important to try. What if no one told us about Dr. Sarno? What if Sarno gave up on his approach because of all the rejection he has received? I think we can each do at least a little bit to help get the word out.
Jim |
| miehnesor |
Posted - 08/07/2006 : 11:33:21
Art and others may be right about nature being a strong factor in TMS. I can relate to the sensitivity to animals personality as well. I can remember as a kid not liking fishing because I didn't want to hurt the fish whereas other kids wouldn't even think twice about it.
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| sonora sky |
Posted - 08/07/2006 : 10:46:34
I can really relate to the sensitivity thing--especially with animals. It tears my heart out to see animals in helpless situations, or to even have the thought of people torturing animals. I immediately become enraged when I see or think these things, and I burst out crying at the same time. Not to get Al Gore back into this forum, but, what instantly choked me up in that film (Inconvenient Truth) was when they showed the (animated) polar bear desperately trying to find some ice to climb up on. The thought that these polar bears would perish (from exhaustion!) because of something we humans did to our environment just kills me.
I remember as a kid my mom wouldn't let me watch Bambi or Tarzan because I would get so hysterical when Bambi's/Tarzan's parents get killed (and this happens early on in both films)-- I would ball through the entire rest of the movie. I find this interesting because this sensitivity was in place even before my father died (when I was 10). I was also adopted (as an infant), so I think I definitely have some loss issues to deal with. . .
Working at an animal rescue place is always something I thought I would never be able to (or want to) do, emotionally. But I've just recently volunteered to help feed a feral cat colony (the cats have been trapped, spayed/neutered, and released), so we'll see how that goes. I'm trying to push myself outside of my comfort zone and combat some deep-seeded fears. I'm not sure if it's the 'right' thing to do, but, well, here I go! |
| Singer_Artist |
Posted - 08/06/2006 : 20:58:38
Art and Kether!
I am NOT ALONE! I have always, still am..been EXTREMELY over sensitive when it comes to animals especially..I work as an animal rights activist part time but i cannot even view the projects sent to me completely..IT destroys me...When my turtle died as a kid i nearly lost my mind..So then my parents kept death from me as much as possible.."Karen cannot handle such things.." So now i have this fear of death and this oversensitivity in general to seeing anyone suffer..I even sometimes put others b4 myself which has hurt me a great deal...
Right now I am in a situation wherein I think I may have met my true soul mate..."Watch out what you ask for, pray about, you just might get it!" He is from NY and I have been dying to move back home..
Now that the reality is upon me I have to make some terribly tough choices..It's one thing leaving my roomie/bro who is like family to me and will be sooo sad...but I might have to give my dogs to him..They love him and they love living here..We could never separate the dogs either, they are buddies..This potential love of my life is REALLY allergic to DOGS! Just my luck..What an impossible and tortureous choice to have to make..Now My foot pain is REALLY bad..I couldn't even finish my walk today..ANd the neck isn't too good either...I feel like a mess about all of this... |
| larkascending |
Posted - 08/06/2006 : 20:24:05
Hi Kether,
Greetings from a fellow Canadian. I can't find a TMS doctor or therapist near me but you may be in luck if you are in Western Canada - there seems to be a TMS doctor (chiropractor?) in Vancouver/Richmond B.C. by the name of Sean Graham, D.C. 604-274-7224. I got his name off of the mindobodymedicine.com
Lark. |
| miehnesor |
Posted - 08/06/2006 : 13:40:53
quote:
Originally posted by kether
how do you find a TMS shrink? I see a therapist now who says I put "too much emphasis" on the mindbody & warns that it may be a way of me "blaming myself for my illness" she does help with other things but I find myself battling her opinions internally constantly. it sure would be great to talk to someone who thought mindbody too.
It's important that you find a therapist that you connect with not only consciously but unconsciously. What I mean by that is someone who you feel validates your feelings and doesn't shame you for your feelings. Someone to encourage you to feel your own feelings. This sounds pretty basic but it's surprising how many therapists are afraid of there own repressed feelings and therefore prevent their clients from getting to theirs. They do this so they don't have to deal with there own feelings.
Alice Miller talks a lot about this in "The Drama of the Gifted Child". I think you might do well to read this very short but powerful book which explains a lot of the damage we get from well intentioned but still manipulative actions of parents.
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| art |
Posted - 08/06/2006 : 05:51:07
quote:
makes me wonder if my unconscious is hiding a BIG secret or something, since Sarno says the proportion of symptoms is equal to the repressed emotions. with all I've had (symptoms-wise) & for how long (5yrs), you would think I grew up in a war zone getting beaten daily. any insights?
As miche talks about, environment is only part of the picture. How you interact with that enviroment is if anything even more important.
By most objective measures the type of crappy upbringing I had was pretty unspectacular, but I was born with a sensitive nature so I wouldn't do as well in that situation as someone with a stronger temperament. Even at a very young age I would feel sorry for people and animals to such a degree that it was quite painful for me...Take a kid like that, have his parents call him a few names, amd there's going to be some damage...
On the other side of the spectrum, I remember reading a few years back about certain nearly invulnerable kids who not only survive but thrive in situations that would just crush many of us.. |
| Nor |
Posted - 08/05/2006 : 21:50:19
Kether,
I called Dr. Sarno's office and asked for a referral for a TMS therapist near me. I'm not sure where you are located but the NYC area has at least a few choices. Also, do a search under "Tarpit Yoga" and you'll find a site for a yoga instructor who has recovered from TMS and she writes her inspirational story. On that website, she provides a list of doctors in the US who specialize in TMS. Maybe you could go from there.
Just curious, why do you and Jim still visit the fibro websites if you are convinced its TMS? Do you give others the info? If so, what is the response/reception to TMS ideas?
Nor |
| Jim1999 |
Posted - 08/04/2006 : 23:00:01
Kether,
Congratulations on your success so far!
I made a full recovery from fibromyalgia seven years ago. During my recovery, I never had to deal with any abuse issues, and I certainly haven't lived in war zone. Some people just naturally tend to repress more than others. I mainly had to deal with a lot of little issues.
By the way, I think that we are both members on the same fibro forum. I will be responding to your posting there in the next day or two.
Jim |
| Nor |
Posted - 08/04/2006 : 20:44:19
Kether,
I also felt as though my symptoms were more severe than my history indicated. I meant to respond to your other post but was having keyboard issues. My symptoms looked a lot like yours - including the neuro stuff and vibration sensations. I described it as "feeling like I was standing on a moving subway". I also had widespread muscle and joint stuff, dizziness, malaise...the whole gamut. I hate to even go through all that. Most of it is in the past, thanks to Sarno. I am seeing a wonderful TMS shrink now and I've learned that my history may not have seemed so tragic but how I reacted to it emotionally was pretty extreme. Lots of people's parents divorce but when you think about how devastating it can be to a sensitive child - it kind of makes sense. (Not trying to judge other forum members who may be divorced - just making a point.) Your history is probably emotionally influencing your current life more than you are aware of. At least that's what I'm discovering.
I found Sarno's books life changing but not enough for me to really pick it apart. Not sure if rage is the only emotion that causes TMS. Don't give up and don't worry so much about all the symptoms. Its quite liberating to let go and remind yourself that all the tests were negative and its a psychological problem for which there is an answer.
Nor |
| miche |
Posted - 08/04/2006 : 20:30:12
People with tms are in general a sensitive bunch, I seem to pick up on other people's distress, especially love ones, I remember not being able to enjoy my day if my son was upset or sick, as a child I would have stood on my head so my mom would stop crying, one would think that I own a radar the way I can feel other people's mood, sometimes we carry other people's baggage and assume responsibility that are not ours, this is bond to create all kinds of emotions at the subconcious level, abuse and molestation are not the only reason for tms, sometimes we are our own worst enemy , I am not saying that these emotions are yours , only that tms is very complex and individual.You say that you are very sensitive, remember that the emotions that are threatening to erupt are at the subconscious level, first you have to accept that they exist even if you do not understand their source, hope this helps a bit, I am fairly new to this board, I was diagnosed with fibro ten years ago, however I AM NOW CONVINCED THAT IT IS ALL EMOTIONAL |
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