| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| jeromejerome |
Posted - 06/07/2006 : 14:03:27
Hi,
I recently read Dr. Sarno's book, "The Mindbody Connection." I'm a mostly healthy 25/m and seem to fit the profile for TMS.
About 6 months ago I started having back and neck pain without an obvious cause. I attributed it to computer use. I also noticed myself becoming a bit irritable sometimes. It wasn't too big of a deal. I then went scuba diving about 3 months ago. After this I was anxious and worried (possibly bringing back feelings of asthma as a kid?). I then developed a sinus infection during a stressful period of traveling. During this time I started monitoring every symptom. As the major symptoms decreased I kept finding something else to be anxious about. Now I am left with neck pain, a TMJ problem, and notice floaters in my eyes (always had these, but didn't pay attention). At first I kept thinking that something was physically wrong with me but now I've come to the conclusion that it is probably a result of TMS.
I have never really worried about my health, but now I find myself anxious and actively seeking something to worry about. It's almost as if I've developed some strange desire to be anxious. How do I go about getting back to my old self? After acceptance of TMS should I just expect to get rid of the anxiety and worry?
Thanks! |
| 18 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| ralphyde |
Posted - 06/12/2006 : 12:37:48
I also like Dr. Sopher's book, To Be or Not to Be - Pain Free. Sometimes he is able to state something even more clearly than Dr. Sarno. Here are a couple of examples:quote:
With the availability of CT and now MRI scanners, it is possible to obtain remarkable images of the body. That is the good news. The bad news is that many of these images will be reported as abnormal - one study reported in the New England Journal of Medicine that greater than 60% of spine MRIs showed abnormalities, the same percentage in those without pain as with pain. Virtually every person over 20 who has a spine MRI will be told they have degenerative disc disease, disc herniation, degenerative changes, or some other abnormality. As these findings are present equally, no matter whether symptoms exist, it is Dr. Sarno's and my contention that these are incidental, rarely the cause for pain. Unfortunately, physicians are taught to find a physical cause for physical symptoms and thus tell their patients about their "back problem."
Being told that you have a "problem" or "condition" can aid the "nocebo response." This is the opposite of the placebo response. With a placebo, belief in a worthless remedy can provide relief, almost always temporary, due to the desire to be well and faith in the value of the remedy. With a nocebo, symptoms will persist or intensify as a result of being informed, incorrectly, that a significant defect or problem is to blame. This is a critical part of conditioning - coming to believe that certain actions, circumstances, or aspects of the environment are the cause of symptoms, when in fact the cause lies in the mind.
quote:
Eliminating the pain is startlingly simple. We can banish the pain and thwart the brain's strategy by simply understanding and accepting that the pain has a psychological causation, that it is not physically based.
Unfortunately, if your physician does not consider TMS in the process of generating a differential diagnosis of your symptoms, it is possible that he or she will give an incorrect diagnosis. This occurs all too frequently as a physical cause is mistakenly offered. This results in a treatment plan that it often unsuccessful. As an example, many people with back pain are told that their symptoms are due to a herniated disc or disc degeneration, when in fact these findings are often incidental and normal. This helps to explain why physical therapy, medications, and surgery are often unsuccessful.
Ralph
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| Dave |
Posted - 06/12/2006 : 08:04:45
I haven't read the new one yet, but I like Healing Back Pain better than The Mindbody Connection. It's just an easier read.
If you want something more like "TMS for Dummies" (no offense, I mean it as a compliment  ) I would suggest Dr. Sopher's book. It's not as comprehensive as Dr. Sarno's books but offers a simple, common sense approach to understanding TMS. |
| Suz |
Posted - 06/12/2006 : 06:51:00
Hate the new book - sorry Sarno! I always always recommend "healing Back Pain" to all newcomers - why - for it's great simplicity! I am only a third of a way through the new one and I am bored out of my mind and don't really want to read on. I was so excited when I heard he was writing another. I have to beat my last two TMS demons - mild acne and fatigue - the fatigue is driving me crazy. I am in extremely good health but convinced myself that I had to do a particular diet to have energy and clear skin. Now - when I eat off the diet, I feel awful. I think it has to be conditioning. I think Sarno may cover some more equivalents in the new book and that is why I am going to bully my way through it. |
| drziggles |
Posted - 06/11/2006 : 20:49:20
Ralph--
as you know, there are some things that are out of our controls, and the behaviors of our loved ones fall in that category! you did the best you could to introduce her to TMS, and she was not accepting, like 85% of the general population. her outcome from here is also up to her... |
| ralphyde |
Posted - 06/11/2006 : 18:09:02
I recently finished The Divided Mind, and liked it very much. I particularly liked the chapters by Dr. James Rochelle (an orthopedic surgeon) and Dr. Andrea Leonard-Segal (a Rheumatologist), and how Dr. Sarno changed their practices for the better.
And I liked the additional material that Dr. Sarno wrote. It may be too heavy for the first time reader of Dr. Sarno, but for those thirsting for more, I think it is great.
Meanwhile, I have given copies of Healing Back Pain to two friends with longstanding back pain (17 years in one case, and about the same in the other). As of today, both have come back to me to thank me and tell me that they are now pain free from reading the book.
Unfortunately, in spite of my best persuasion, my wife has just gotten a spinal fusion operation, to my dismay. I hope that it will help her, but I fear that she has compounded her problems. Our story, for those who don't remember, is at http://tmshelp.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=766
As Dr. Sarno quoted on p. 131 of The Divided Mind, quote:
As put succinctly by a young woman patient years ago, "Denial of the syndrome is part of the syndrome." In addition to creating pain, the psyche creates doubt - the better to keep the syndrome going.
Ralph |
| HilaryN |
Posted - 06/11/2006 : 14:10:10
I agree with drziggles about the 2 later books. I’m only on the 3rd chapter of “The Divided Mind” so I can’t judge properly yet. I’ve found it hard going so far – maybe because I’m reading on the journey to work so it’s not the best reading environment. I, too, was wondering who it was aimed at.
“The Mindbody Prescription” was the one I read and used to get better, but later I borrowed “Healing Back Pain” from my father and I found it a much easier read. I’ve just recommended it to someone with back pain, rather than the later ones.
Hilary N |
| tennis tom |
Posted - 06/11/2006 : 12:11:48
Hello Doctor,
Thanks for your reply and thanks for being an active participant on the TMS FORUM. I feel that bridging the communication gap, between us TMS civilians and the medical community, will be a neccessary step, for medicine to hopefully evolve to accepting the Good Doctor's theory. You are certaily doing your share--we are all in this together.
In a disucussion I had with Donald Dubin, he mentioned that Dr. Sarnno had written a new scientific book, geared to his peers, but was having difficulty getting it published. Perhaps, his latest book, THE DIVIDED MIND, is the fruit of the work in question. Perhaps it was homogenized to be more sellable to a wider audience, versus being a textbook for medical specialists?
I'm shooting in the dark here because, though I ordered THE DIVIDED MIND, pre to its publication, I have only read the intro so far. This being due to my TMS zeal, being dampened, by my "NOT TMS" dx by Dr. Schechter in L.A.
As, a true TMS procrastinator, I am waiting for the "right" time, to settle down with it to immerse myself.
My first experience with Dr. Sanro was probably similar to how many others have stumbled upon him. This was in the Back Care section of my local book store--searching for the ANSWER to my chronic back pain, after just doing a yoga class.
My first TMS book was the Doctor's first:
Mind Over Back Pain: A Radically New Approach to the Diagnosis and Treatment of Back Pain
by John Sarno
It was a small paperback and a quick read. It schooled me in TMS fundamentals. I think the only substantive changes, since then, is that Dr. Sarno no longer refers patients to physical therapy.
As, it was my first, this little tome, is still my favorite. I belive it's out of print but proably could be easily found, used, over the internet. True to being a TMS "goodist", I loaned out my copy long ago and no longer have it.
Regards,
tt |
| drziggles |
Posted - 06/11/2006 : 09:24:14
Unfortunately, I think that Sarno's books are getting more complicated and less user-friendly, ever since Healing Back Pain. He is focusing too much on the historical background of TMS in psychology, particularly with his endless focusing on Freud. I understand that the unconscious is the key to TMS, and for that we are in debt to Freud, but what was the point of his retrospectively analyzing Freud's case histories for instances of TMS? How does that help anyone?
Looking at the book from the perspective of a new patient who has been told they have TMS, I think the book is too "wonkish" and not practical enough. One of my big problems in using TMS theory in practice is getting people to read the damn books in the first place. Most people don't like to read, and are looking for a quick fix. Then, hand them Mindbody Prescription or the new one, and the average person without a college education would need a dictionary for every fourth word, and still doesn't get it, because of the excessive focus on psychology in an impractical way. And, that is IF they can even make their way through the damn thing, which most do not.
I don't understand who the new book is written for, frankly. Rather than getting away from focusing on Freud, he is getting more and more into the Freudianism as a focus of discussion. Given that 90% of people think that this school of psychology is outdated and discredited, how does this help his case? If he wants to go for legitimacy from the medical profession, he needs more pathophysiology, not more psychological background. If he wants mass acceptance from the general public, he needs to make it more accessible, not less so. However, I have been enjoying the parts written by other physicians, which give some new perspective, especially to a practicing physican like myself who is trying to use these techniques.
What we need is a TMS book that is written for the average person. Sarno's (especially the last two) are too technical and jargon-filled; Marc Sopher's is, frankly, too juvenile. Fred Amir's sounds like an infomercial.
I hate to criticize the Man, but if you look at the books from the perspective of someone who is not already a TMS convert, I think you may agree. What do you folks think?
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| tennis tom |
Posted - 06/10/2006 : 01:16:39
Drziggles, can you please elaborate on what you don't like about Dr. Sarno's new book?
Thank you,
tt |
| jeromejerome |
Posted - 06/09/2006 : 12:13:55
Hi Victoria,
Scuba was probably just the trigger. I managed to finish the scuba course and did about 9 dives. I blamed it for my sinus infection and other problems but it might have been the thing that pushed it over the critical point. Since then I've been closely monitoring every symptom I've had. If I stubbed my toe I'd probably worry about that for awhile. Just a few months ago I used to be anxiety and pain free and never had a headache. Strange, eh.
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| victoria |
Posted - 06/08/2006 : 20:38:13
Scuba diving brought about the same thing with me. I think I was going down with my daughter first time for both of us, and I all of a sudden got very nervous. Maybe that should be very enlightening for me, bringing on anxiousness about other things in my life I was unaware of before. |
| jeromejerome |
Posted - 06/08/2006 : 16:55:02
Thanks so much. I'll start reading and hopefully will be back to my old self soon. I'm only 25 but it's like I've gone from feeling 18 to 70 years old over the last several months.
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| drziggles |
Posted - 06/08/2006 : 16:28:31
By formulating that list, you have only taken the first step. Now you have to explore all of those issues in great detail, as well as try to reprogram your brain to stop causing pain by going through the 12 reminders in Healing Back pain multiple times per day. If you have read the therapy chapter of any of Sarno's books, you'll get a good idea of where to go. While I don't really like his newest book, The Divided Mind, the therapy chapter is quite good. If you do some searching on the forum, you'll find the "homework" that he gives out to his patients (this is included in the new book). This is a great guide to the work that you need to do. |
| jeromejerome |
Posted - 06/08/2006 : 12:45:49
Thanks for the help. Now that I've identified many of my sources of repressed anger, where do I go from here? This wasn't discussed much in Dr. Sarno's book. Maybe keeping a journal and keep telling myself that it's psychological?
It's difficult because many of the things that release the stress cause stress. For example, going out to dinner with friends seems to give me a tension headache and my eyes will get really tired so I become afraid of going out. It's also difficult because I just moved after traveling and don't have many of my normal outlets. Fortunately this experience has taught me what's important in life.
Thanks again. |
| n/a |
Posted - 06/08/2006 : 07:56:23
No kids, no wife, easy job!!!! That alone would be a source of stress for many people believe it or not. |
| drziggles |
Posted - 06/07/2006 : 20:17:46
Man, you just nailed all of the important things. No matter what the particular life stresses someone has, the root of TMS always comes down to that list you mentioned. My guess is that the events (scuba, traveling) were just the excuse your brain needed to get the TMS ball rolling, so don't dwell on them. |
| jeromejerome |
Posted - 06/07/2006 : 15:45:47
Thanks for the help. I have very few normal stresses. No kids, no wife, easy job. Maybe that's my problem. For most of my life I had a very busy schedule with an average amount of stress. Then I traveled for awhile with no schedule while being somewhat socially isolated. But the scuba diving and traveling while sick is really what set it off.
Maybe it's the feeling of losing control and realizing that I'm not invincible. It was the first time in my life that I actually felt that I was helpless.
other repressed emotions throughout my life include,
need to succeed,
not show emotion,
be good,
not cause a scene,
say things are ok,
show a happy exterior,
not offend,
fear of failure,
I wonder if it was bound to happen or that the traveling set it off. Anyway, Thanks.
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| drziggles |
Posted - 06/07/2006 : 15:22:02
Not quite. The plan is not to get rid of the worry, but to figure out what it is you are actually worried about. The health concerns and physical symptoms are merely a distraction from the repressed emotions that are the real focus of concern. Keep rereading the book, and start journaling. You are allowed to write about anything but physical symptoms. One good way to start is to think about things in your life that you should be stressed about, but aren't.
Naturally, you should consult with your doctor before making any medical decisions. Good luck! |
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