| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| FlyByNight |
Posted - 01/24/2006 : 08:39:16
Hi all,
I am writing you these letters because I just feel that I am going crazy and I really need some help/advices to get through this....
First I want to thank you for your time. I red Sarnos Books 1 month ago and I find my story kind of in the grey zone. I want to stick to Sarno's theory and I do it 80% of the time (which often improve my symtoms lightly) but I still have some difficulties to completely reject the structural diagnosis. Here is my story
First I must tell you that I am fully corresponding to the typical TMS personnality: perfectionnist, over achiever, prone to anxiety and panic attacs (since 3-4 years )etc etc....
Now I am 34 yrs old and for many years I have been dealing with weird moving symtoms that now I relate 100% to TMS (flank pain, benign cardiac arythmia, diaphragm spasm, middle back pain etc.). I also have what my chiropractor told me a 'false short leg' and a light 'functionnal scoliosis' that are related to a bad posture that I am trying to correct since a couple of years.
6 months ago, I had a very mild whiplash (I got hit in the neck while playing hockey), nothing that in theory should have hurt me so much, and since then, My life is a downward spiral toward hell .... Here is why ...
Soon after this little incident, I started having tinnitus in the left ear. As I was going crazy I went to a ENT specialist that saw nothing wrong with my inernal ear. However he did suspect that the tinitus was related to a small vascular spasm or muscle spasms in my neck following the accident. He suggest to have an MRI done for my neck and my brain just to check if my vertebral artery and the blood vessels in my brain were ok and the results were very OK actually ... No problem at all ... !
He also suggested another MRI (musculo squelettal of my neck) which revealed a very small disk protrusion in C7 (the vertebra at the level of the shoulders), which did not explain de tinnitus. At that time I felt many strong spasm in my neck following. I almost felt that all my muscles were just not working properly in the left side of myneck. They were not contracting and relaxing properly along my neck motion as compared with before the incident.
With all this information, I started physical therapy once a week . The first physical therapist I saw was nothing more than a butcher as he gave me very extreme exercices to perform with my neck which I was informed after were totally counterindicated in my condition. I made my condition very bad and inflammation starting in the soft tissues surrounding my left first cervical vertebra, which increased the intensity of the neck spasms. At that time I was in an anxiety peak like never in my life...
I went to another physical therapist who was far more competent in my modest opinion. At the begining, the treatments did help reducing inflammation and muscle spasms. After 2 months i was feeling relatively ok, and Then I started to have neurological pain while rotating my neck on the left (sympathetic symtoms such as adrenalin discharge and violent pain). I then went to an osteopath and many other specialists for the next 5 months... All the treaments I got did help for a day or 2 MAX... With all the symtoms coming back soon after including muscle spasms, tendonc and neurological pain. I did continue the exercices at home during this time and the only thing it did was making my condition worse again .....
Now , I still have these neck spasms, by neck is constantly cracking, I always have pain on the left upper side of my neck, Tinnitus is coming and going. Some times the pain is travelling down my SPINE on the left side. And of course I am going totally crazy ... Meds told me that i am entering the magnificiant realm of Chronic pain and that they cannot do a lot for me ...
So to summarize, my condition just went worse and worse for the last 6 months. I feel there is are two explanations possible: 1) My constant anxiety about my condition since the hockey accident increased the spasms in my neck which prevent my to heal properly or 2) the physical therapy exercices that were counterindicated for me just broke something in the soft tissues in my upper left neck that does not want to heal because my neck is not immobilized. Or maybe a combination of both ....
The pain at the moment is like a mix of stiffness, burning sensation, and nerve pain ... The most intense spot of pain is still in my upper left neck but I also have softer pain in other areas of my neck and back...
I hope you will understand why I have a hard rejecting 100% the structural diagnosis and any comments from you would be very much appreciated.
Thank you so much in advance.
Pat
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| 15 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| salamander |
Posted - 01/25/2006 : 17:48:25
Pat,
I saw that you addressed an earlier post of mine, but I thought I would respond to this post.
You mentioned: " i also have neurological symptoms such as adrenalin burst and electrical shocks that i associate to severe structural damage in my spine "
Two years ago I was knocked unconcious from a bike accident. I was not wearing a helmet, but fortunately, survived the accident. I was however, dizzy and foggy (concussion) for a couple of months. Along with this I had real bad "whiplash" that really heart for at least a couple of months. To make matters worse, I had the strangest "electrical shock-like symptoms" in my neck....whenever I moved my head forward I could feel the shocks move down my body. These were particularly alarming, even thought they did not really hurt. What's more, I read about this symptom called "Lermitt's sign sp?" which sounded exactly like the symptoms that I was experiancing. This "Lermitt's sign" is supposedly often found in people with MS. I was so alarmed by this that I wrote Dr. Sarno and asked him about it. After a couple of letters back and forth, Sarno said that he has seen many patients with this "sign" and that there was no cause for alarm and that my symptoms where TMS. This was not to hard to believe since I have had so many TMS disorders throughout the years. I honestly feel that you're hockey induced whiplash has turned into a nasty case of TMS. I would suggest that you do what previous posters have indicated and treat it as such.
As to Joints/spine/neck cracking and popping....well, my neck and back popped all the time when I had TMS. As soon as I recovered from the TMS, most (if not all) of the cracking and popping stopped. I remember when I had my back pain, I had a weird "catch" in my back....as if it did not want to go past a certain point. This was very alarming, but it totally went away when I accepted the TMS diagnosis.
You will get over you're "whiplash"... the tissue, structures are fine. You're mind is working you over...
Regards,
Doug
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| FlyByNight |
Posted - 01/25/2006 : 13:14:12
Dave,
you guys gave me the additional knowledge I needed to go further . I can tell you I will beat it and considering the fact that I am a big big skecptical scientist by nature, it will be a wonderful succes story to share with other afterwards. ...
Cheers.
P. |
| Dave |
Posted - 01/25/2006 : 12:59:27
Once you start accepting the diagnosis it is common for your brain to increase the symptoms in an attempt to thwart you from discovering its secret agenda. Don't let it succeed! |
| FlyByNight |
Posted - 01/25/2006 : 09:52:34
You guys are all amazing ...
this morning I woke up not only with the worse pain I had since 6 months but also with the resolution of ending it buy jumping 100% into TMS approach .... I'll give it a full try ...
thanx again for all your support.
P. |
| Susie |
Posted - 01/25/2006 : 08:56:44
Hi flybynight. Your entire post was structural. You are consumed with identifying the origin and supposed cause of every pain and noise you are experiencing. It's like listening to yourself breathe. I don't think you are close to believing 80% Sarno. I believe to get well you have to jump in and give it a real try. I had everything you have except tinnitus plus about 6 more equivalent symptoms. My back cracked all the time. It's nothing, honestly. Instead of writing composites of your pains, try writing about what's on your mind. Your main problem is what all of us have experienced. FEAR!! You must get past the fear to get control of your symptoms. Quit focusing on the severity and type of pain you are having and try to think physicological. It is very difficult to do at first, especially when you are having terrible spasms. I know all about that. But once you begin to focus on your brain it becomes second nature. I have been on this forum almost 2 years and the info. I have received from Sarno's books and the people on here have changed my life. This method of thinking is so impowering and the sad thing is that so many don't know about it or refuse or are unable to accept it. Don't be in that group. Really try. Wellness is totally in your control if you just take control. |
| lastlostmonkey |
Posted - 01/25/2006 : 08:20:54
Hi,
I suppose the first question is, have you been tested for nerve damage? If so and the outcome was negative you can move onto other things. It sounds like you have exhausted all possible physical causes, so you are here with the Sarnophiles. I don't like the 'search the forum and you'll find it' response, but there have been several threads both on neck spasms and on cracking or popping of various bits of various people.
Search for 'cracking' or 'clicking' or 'popping' and maybe 'spine' (not in inverted commas, obviously). Here's two to start with:
http://www.tmshelp.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=1539
http://www.tmshelp.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=1507
For neck spasms search for 'neck spasms', again, here's one to start you off (scroll down to Saga's message):
http://www.tmshelp.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=1536
Hope this is helpful, not interpreted as rejection.
cheers,
monkey
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| FlyByNight |
Posted - 01/25/2006 : 07:48:39
thank you again for all your replies....
To be honest, I must say that because it all started with tinnitus, I did pay attention a lot to it in the past months. However, even if its still there (coming and going), It does not botherinut g me . I know it is tension induced now ... When my neck feels relax (which happened 2-3 times in the last 6 months) tinnitus is gone. ....
What drives me crazy at the moment are 1) the pain 2) the muscle spasms and 3) the constant spine cracking... These 3 factors alltogether are explaining why i have difficulties rejecting the structural diagnosis for I red many post relating TMS to pain , but not a lot of post relating TMS to Cracks and constant SPASMS while there is plenty of litterature relating persistent spasms to nerve damage or something like that ....
Again, any comments that could help me increase my understanding of TMS given these facts are more than welcome ....
cheers !
Pat
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| lastlostmonkey |
Posted - 01/25/2006 : 07:00:50
Hi,
this is very timely for me. I got tinnitus, left ear, out of the blue, a few days before New Year. No loud noises, no rock concerts, just sitting at home alone (aha) feeling stressed (aha) about work and having recently seen my father who has been told his hearing is that of someone 30 years older (aha). Doctor said some inflammation, do you have pain? No, but of course two days later I did. So I have an ear infection, stopped swimming (because I was concerned about exacerbating it) and walked instead, much less strenuous.
Of course a week after this my usual RSI type pain, which was decreasing to almost nothing before the New Year was back in force, worse than I'd had it for months. At the time, forgetful doubter that I am, I thought perhaps it was the new chair I had at work, but I've swapped that now (I know, kick me) and it's still the same. The doctor I saw about my ear yesterday said there was no inflammation, I would be referred to a specialist at the local hospital.
My conclusion? TMS, and, cleverly, something that stopped me from exercising so I lost that challenge to my usual TMS pain. The tinnitus and ear pain haven't got worse, haven't got better. That doesn't seem like an infection to me. I will wait and see what the specalist says, but I'd be pretty confident betting that there's nothing to find.
Stick with it, y'all. My belief is growing.
the last lost monkey
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| wrldtrv |
Posted - 01/24/2006 : 23:11:55
Pat,
I have firsthand experience of the tinnitus you mention. For me, it was completely psychological, stress-related, and went away entirely after the novelty wore off. This was about 8 years ago. I remember my older brother visiting and going into excruciating detail about the tinnitus he had just been diagnosed with. His was and is real, related to very damaged hearing. Anyway, after listening to him for a couple of days I began to hear ringing in my own ears! This is crazy, I thought. I don't have tinnitus. But the ringing got worse, more persistent (worse in bed at night). I went to an audiologist for tests. You have excellent hearing, the hearing of an 18 year old, he said. More doctors, more tests. Finally a year later I had a brain MRI. Nothing. Meanwhile, for whatever reason, the tinnitus faded and then disappeared permanently. Since it is doubtful that REAL tinnitus would ever disappear (unless there is a treatable disease like Meneure's disease...), obviously my problem was 100% psychological and when it ran its course it was gone for good.
I can't say what's behind your tinnitus, but I would be willing to bet you have the same problem I did. Why? Because your tinnitus like mine appeared overnight. And because you were (like I was) already very stressed out with other things when it appeared. I hope this helps.
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| Jim1999 |
Posted - 01/24/2006 : 22:09:28
Pat,
When my back pain became severe and caused me to miss a significant amount of work, I decided to try some fairly aggressive physical therapy. The idea was that weak back muscles helped to cause back pain, so these muscle needed to be strengthened. A LOT.
During my first therapy session, I felt my pain change and start to spread. Soon, it had spread to various places throughout my body, leading to a diagnosis of fibromyalgia. This diagnosis is sort of a "life sentence"...patients don't die of it but they usually suffer for life. It used to make me so upset to think about what damage that therapy might have caused.
Then I heard about Dr. Sarno. After 5-6 weeks of using the treatment in his books, I was fully recovered. Permanent damage from the physcial therapy? I guess there wasn't any.
Jim |
| FlyByNight |
Posted - 01/24/2006 : 20:40:59
thank you all for your reply ... I am at a point into this journey where support is very important to me ... the pain is so unbearable sometimes I would like to cut my own head to remove the pain, i am becoming very impatient and unpleasant because of the pain with my wife and my little daugther (who are veeeeeerrrryy tolerant with me but not without limits). I feel very guilty about it.
I really do want to stick to sarnos approach for I believe I fit in many TMS characteristics. But Geez, rejecting 100% the injury hypothesis is sooooo hard .....
Your comments are helping . thanx. |
| HilaryN |
Posted - 01/24/2006 : 15:13:13
Pat,
Keep reading the books. It took me a couple of months before I noticed any improvement in my condition, and I understand how easy it is to have doubts. Keep at it - it can take a while, but you'll get there in the end. The fact that you've had even a small improvement is good news. Focus on that if you get any doubts.
All the best,
Hilary N |
| Dave |
Posted - 01/24/2006 : 09:09:31
Your story is not uncommon. Preoccupation with physical symptoms, seeing many different physicians, getting different diagnoses ... it can be an endless spiral. Everything you do to acknowledge or treat your symptoms as a structural problem strengthens the TMS grip. The symptoms are serving their intended purpose (to serve as a distraction) so they will continue.
Both of your explanations are firmly planted in the physical realm and thus strengthen the TMS grip:
The "whiplash" is a non-injury. If you got hit in the neck, you may have gotten a bruise or a muscle strain that would have healed completely in a few weeks. There is no structual explanation for continued pain.
The physical therapy did not do any damage or prevent healing. The injury, if there was one, is healed. The physical therapy exacerbated the symptoms because it plays right into TMS hands: it has you focused in the physical realm.
You've ruled out any serious disease or injury so it is highly likely your symptoms are TMS. To get relief you must stop all physical treatments and accept that the pain has a psychological origin. Until you do that, the pain will continue. |
| Fox |
Posted - 01/24/2006 : 09:02:18
I should have said TRT trained audiologist rather than TNT trained. |
| Fox |
Posted - 01/24/2006 : 09:00:55
For tinnitus, go to www.tinnitus.org - reading this web site and seeing a TNT trained audiologist got rid of the problem for me after 3 years of misery. Basically, for me, it was just another TMS equivalent, but I needed some special techniques beyond what Sarno offers, such as noise conditioning (I believe that's what it's called - where, paradoxically, you expose yourself to almost constant sounds rather than avoiding them). |
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