| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Hilary |
Posted - 06/13/2005 : 05:12:41
So I've been working Sarno for about 6 months now. I've recovered fully from back pain and am getting a real handle on the dizziness that's plagued me for 10 years.
This weekend, I stood up to my mum in a meaningful way (not just the stupid little arguments we usually have) for the first time. I refused to be her therapist, which is a dynamic we've had for years. And along with my brother, we both insisted that she take care of her hearing problem. (She has an issue with her hearing that makes her incredibly sensitive to loud noises. She doesn't complain about it outwardly, but suffice to say it passively dominates the entire family whenever we visit - which pretty sums up my mother).
The next day, mum has the worst backache of her life. She has always suffered back problems (TMS, of course), but this one is worse than anything she's ever had before. "Worse than giving birth", she tells me. She can't move. She looks like death. The doctor is called out, and by evening she's feeling better - doped to the nines with muscle relaxants and painkillers.
So it appears that as I get better, my mother gets worse. Relationships truly are fascinating, aren't they? I am aware of severing some strings between us, and it feels scary. I don't like it, but I also feel the absolute necessity of doing this work, of identifying things in my relationship with her that aren't right for me and fixing them. Of making myself safer, and healing.
I told her I'd mail a copy of Sarno to her and explained that I'd realized emotion played a role in my own symptoms. Will she buy into it? Who knows.
I've been thinking and working on my inner rage, both by myself and with a therapist, and the thing I come back to over and over again is my ****ed-up relationship with my mother. I've done therapy before but thanks to Sarno and my current therapist I now know where to focus most of my attention.
My relationship with both my parents - but perhaps more so with my mother - is a sort of knotted-up double-bind. "We love you, we made sacrifices for you, you've got so much potential, now use it to make us happy." Everything was done in the name of love, but the demands and expectations were almost unbearable. Musically, academically, intellectually, I was expected to excel and succeed - and always, always knew that this was the way of getting love and approval from my mum and dad. Confusingly, this was also combined with the message, "don't compete, don't boast about your accomplishments, be nice". Excel, be artistic, but don't compete and keep everyone else happy? Um, how?? My mother in particular always told me how much she'd been deprived of as a child and how she was sacrificing in order to give me those things she'd always wanted.
Unfortunately I never enjoyed any of it. Now, looking back, I realize why not. Having an ability, say, an affinity for music, matters not a whit if it's effectively taken from you in order to make a parent feel better about themselves. "The Drama of the Gifted Child" by Alice Miller sums this up much, much better than I ever could. Even today I find it hard to listen to music because I get so angry inside. And that's really upsetting.
Add to this the fact that my mum effectively turned me into her therapist, the "special child" who was the only person in the world she could talk to and you've got a real recipe for TMS. I was the center of her universe, I was told, I was the only person she could pour out her heart to. What crap! Again with the hindsight of age and therapy, I realize how utterly wrong it is to do this to a child. Children are NOT therapists. Children shouldn't be used as therapists for adults who are desperately seeking love for themselves. Making children do things that make adults feel better about themselves is exploitation. Telling children that they're the center of your universe puts them under horrendous pressure, and it's also a lie because hey guess what, I'm the only person who is at the center of my universe and that's the way it should be.
Doing all this in the name of "love" is simply wrong.
It has been enormously difficult to reach my rage, because when expectation is so tied up with love you don't really know which way to turn. For years and years I was convinced I'd had the happiest childhood in the world. I couldn't actually remember it, but I knew I'd been given a lot, and "loved", so the fact that I was depressed seemed to come out of nowhere. I concluded that I was simply suffering from an illness that must run somewhere in the family.
Thank god for my back problems, and discovering Sarno. I'm thinking about myself in a very different way these days - as someone who is deeply angry, rather than "ill" or "depressed".
The work continues. |
| 20 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| miehnesor |
Posted - 04/23/2007 : 15:38:33
Littlebird- Thx for sharing your story about your folks here. I can relate to everything you have said. I fear that my parents are following a similar pattern to yours in that their inner children's dependency needs are coming out more and more as they age. It's sad to see it. I think it's common that parents don't understand that as their children grow up and become adults that they have to separate and be their own person with there own feelings. I agree that if they have major wounds that they try to control their own children and don't respect their childrens needs and feelings. They would never admit to any of this and I know they will never change. It's too late. I just have to work on my own boundaries and hope for the best.
What you said about parents feeling rejected easily is so true in my case as well. What they don't realize, because of their own wounds, is that when someone is angry its because they are hurt. It is not yet a rejection. My mom could have sent a letter reaching out to me and asking me how i felt hurt and why I was angry. Instead she sent a letter rejecting me. It was very accusatory and hurtful. She didn't even sign the letter. If that doesn't feel like abandonment I don't know what does.
I'm going to bring up the letter with my therapist in a couple days. It will be interesting to see what he suggests.
Thx again for your support. Much appreciated! |
| miehnesor |
Posted - 04/23/2007 : 15:12:35
Arm- Thx for sharing your experience with your folks and for the support. I really appreciate it since this is a difficult time for me.
The piece that I keep coming back to is that there doesn't seem to be an appreciation on their part for my feelings- how might I feel about there abrasive behavior. Yes indeed it is anger producing. When the first such incident happened about 3 years ago I was stunned and just froze. At the time the IC was too scared to challenge their behavior.
That was the big breakthrough for me when my wife was surprised that I didn't stand up for her to protect her from their unfair and mean accusations and she suggested that I was unconsciously afraid of my parents and she was right. That was really the beginning of my TMS recovery. I started acting out the anger in therapy which was exactly what my symptoms were trying to protect me from.
Now it's a different story and i'm trying to set some new boundaries. I am not emotionally enmeshed with them the way I was just a few years ago and can push back and hopefully establish a better relationship. It is my hope but ultimately it is not in my hands. All I can do is control my behavior. I can't control theirs. |
| tennis tom |
Posted - 04/23/2007 : 15:05:17
Why do our parents do such a good job of pushing our buttons?
Because they installed them.
some of my favorite excerpts from 'TDM' : http://www.tmshelp.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=2605
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| Littlebird |
Posted - 04/23/2007 : 14:59:49
Micah, I want to tell you how much I appreciate getting to read through this thread, which I'd never have seen if you hadn't bumped it up. Thanks for doing that. I also have to say that I admire your courage in risking the relationship with your parents to protect your wife and children from unreasonable behavior. You're setting a great example for your children, to be able to stand up for their own rights.
As my parents aged I hoped that they would mature and mellow out enough for there to be some improvements in our rocky relationship, but instead it seemed that they regressed emotionally in many ways. In retrospect I think that their inner children came more to the fore as they aged and we ended up trying to have a relationship between all of our inner children, which didn't work out very well. The painful issues they'd never dealt with from their own childhoods blew up again, and in some ways they came to relate to me as if I was their parent and the source of their pain. They're gone now, but their last years were very difficult for me. My brothers went to no contact, because it was just too difficult for them to deal with our parents in their later years.
As a child I did understand what was allowed emotionally, and I didn't dare express anger to my parents. When they were children, they were in the same sort of situation--not allowed to express anger to their parents without some awful repercussions. My mother intentionally taught me to put the feelings of others first, to squelch my own feelings in order to avoid hurting anyone else, including her. She usually did much the same herself, suppressing her feelings when she was sober, but when she drank all the feelings came out, magnified and twisted by the alcohol. Because of what she taught me, I allowed other people to abuse me terribly in my early adulthood, until I finally learned how to put my needs and feelings first in some situations. But it's still very hard for me to stand up for myself and express what I feel and need.
ACL, I like the point you made about it being a major violation when we're trying to protect ourselves and our parents keep on pushing. It does say that our feelings don't matter as much as theirs do. I think it's fairly common for many parents to see their children as some kind of extension of themselves, and to see their children's behavior as a reflection on them, so they feel they have every right to push their way in and exert their influence on us. Sometimes they seem to feel like we "owe" them the right to have that influence, because of all they did for us during our childhood.
When we reject our parents' opinions and influence, they feel like we're rejecting them. I've tried to not repeat the cycle with my own kids, the way my parents repeated what their parents did to them, who were probably just repeating what the generation before them did, and so on down the line. While I do sometimes offer my opinions and suggestions to my kids, I try to make it clear that I respect their right to make their own decisions and to let them know that I won't feel rejected personally if they reject my ideas.
I have a book about some distant relatives who lived in the 1700's and 1800's, which shows the same things have been going on in my family for many generations. Some of them had the same type of mystery symptoms that I've had. They were pushed by family members to lead their lives in a way other than what they really wanted for themselves and they gave in to that pressure, only to pay for it with what was almost certainly TMS.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts and insights on this resurrected thread--it's been helpful to me. Corey |
| armchairlinguist |
Posted - 04/23/2007 : 12:10:31
I am realizing that it can really be a bad thing when we ask for a time out on talking about something, or time off from contact, or clearly try to avoid some subject or contact, and our parents don't let us. Both my parents are pretty classic about this, though my mom is worse. She has twice sent me email while we are living in the same house when I don't want to talk about something or don't want to talk to her. It is unbelievable to me that she cannot leave it alone for a while. I also remember some argument I was having with both of them where I wanted to make my own decision and they wanted to give me advice and I said "Let's not talk about this just now, let's talk about it later." They would not let it alone and I finally ended up actually having a screaming fight with them (very rare since anger was not allowed) yelling at them and telling them I was allowed to not feel like talking about it right then and why was it such a big deal.
I think when we take these actions of avoidance we are trying to protect ourselves and it is a major boundary violation for them to keep pushing. And it says that we don't have the right to ask this, and our feelings about it are not valid. Which is the most toxic thing for the inner child. Their way is the only right way to do it. It makes me really angry.
--
Wherever you go, there you are. |
| miehnesor |
Posted - 04/23/2007 : 11:13:32
Parents- aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaggggggggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!
I'm presently going through the worst patch in my life with my folks right now. We agreed to not talk about a month ago and a few days ago I got the worst letter from my mom that I didn't think was possible. I was absolutely stunned by this letter. The problems run so deep and there does not appear to be a way of resolving the conflict.
The problems started a month ago when I got angry at them for violating my boundaries and speaking badly about my inlaws and my wife. It is a repeat performance of 3 years ago except this time I'm stepping in to shield my family from the negativity coming from my folks. I will not allow this kind of behavior to continue even if it means i'm going to lose my parents in the process.
This is extremely painful and I naturally have a lot of guilt surrounding it. But I have to deal with the guilt and stand up for what is right. My parents are old now and this is not what I envisioned our relationship to be in their old age.
I've had some minor flares in TMS symptoms but nothing dramatic. I think this is actually a good test for my IC to see that he will be OK and will survive even if there is a sense of abandonment going on right now.
It's also interesting to see the reaction of my parents to my own anger. Is it any wonder that I repressed anger and never let them see it when I was a child. Actually I think my IC was very insightful and understood what was and was not allowed emotionally. A great presciption for psychosomatic pain later in life. |
| Singer_Artist |
Posted - 04/18/2007 : 17:08:28
Hilary,Suz, Laura and others dealing with this family stuff,
I feel for you very much and send warm hugs of support..I am reading this topic and writing to get my mind temporarily off of my dog who is very ill..
This is a wonderful thread, full of healing insights and words of wisdom..It is helping me as well..I don't have the emotional/mental energy to get into my childhood issues with my parents etc..I can touch on a very strained relationship with my sister, however..It is relevant here..{I lost my folks 17 yrs ago and miss them terribly..Just hearing you all talk about your parents makes me miss them more,,and yet..it also helps me to think about the dysfunctional crap I dealt with as a child as well..}
I have learned that my only choice is to keep my sister at a distance..We just email now and then and when i am in NY/NJ for a major holiday I run into her..She is a recovering alcoholic who is addicted to Xanax for panic disorder..She is a narcisist..totally and utterly thinks ONLY of herself..She is much older then me and currently dating a man younger then her children! I don't mean to sound judgemental as I have dated men far younger then myself in the past..This issue is that when she is involved, she ignores her children when they need her..
My oldest neice is dealing w/ major problems in her life and relys solely on me for emotional support..I am okay with that as i love her like she was my child or younger sister..We are best friends..But lately, she is leaning on me so much that I can barely breathe..And it is my sister's lack of concern that causes my neice to have to lean so much on me..Last night, when i was crying my eyes out over my dog being so ill and in hospital, my neice called me like 10 times in a row..My friend was visiting and couldn't believe it either..I have had to set a boundary but it is tough because i love her so much..She is dealing w/ alcoholism and major financial and relationship issues..Part of what she is dealing wtih is self created by bad choices..part is not..
On top of that my b/f calls me many times a day w/ reports on the hellish physical pain he is in w/ neck/back/ears/ etc..and all his financial woes..I am the main support for both of them..Normally i can handle it, but w/ my dog this ill (KC is my child) I am at my wits end..
How does one deal w/ such rage toward a parent, a sibling who continues to hurt them and everyone they love??
I have to keep civil with her or my youngest neice might pull away from me..She tends to side w/ her mom even though, deep down, she knows she is wrong..My sister is her prime babysitter, for example, so she must keep peace with her..
My sister manipulates the whole family to walk on eggshells around her with her anxieties, angry outbursts and self absorption..I stay in loose contact only for my neices and nephews sakes..But this rage i feel, especially when she hurts my oldest neice, is probably stuck in my neck!
Right now, honestly, I can only think deeply about my doggie healing..He is defenseless and needs all my attention..I just had to drop my 2 cents on this thread because I got so much out of reading it, and I feel for each and every one of you who is suffering over these awful family issues....
Hugs,
Karen |
| ndb |
Posted - 04/18/2007 : 14:53:37
Hilary, GREAT post. I'm not sure how I missed it before. As a child I had a similar dynamic with my Dad. When he would fight with my Mom, and they weren't talking, he would come to me, and ask me stuff like 'who did I think was in the wrong', or 'do I think its right that she (my mother) is not speaking with him'. Once or twice I tried saying 'I don't know, I don't have any thoughts on this.' And he replied with 'Allright, if you don't care with what's going on in our family, FINE.' Wow, what emotional blackmail. The bastard! And all this happened pretty much constantly from when I was 10 or so, old enough to feel uncomfortable when my parents fought.
I'm grateful to you for writing that post and causing me to remember all this.
ndb |
| armchairlinguist |
Posted - 04/18/2007 : 13:09:50
miehsnor, thanks for bumping this up. This is one of the best threads I've ever read. I was especially struck by Hilary saying she did not remember her childhood but thought it was happy for a long time. I feel the same way. I am afraid to discover what's under there. But plowing ahead anyway...therapy appt. in 3 hours! And all the material about parental high expectations. Indeed.
--
Wherever you go, there you are. |
| miehnesor |
Posted - 04/18/2007 : 12:31:22
This is an old post full of wisdom.
Since i'm presently going through a 'no communication' time with my folks and trying to set more appropriate boundaries I thought I would resurrect Hilary's and others comments that might be useful to others, especially the newcomers, here.
My parents actually look pretty good in relation to other folks parents described here; however, as I go along with my work I realize just how subtle the manipulation of children to satisfy parents needs can be.
What really accellerates my unconscious fear (and the release of the rage) in therapy in my visualization is when I tell the inner child "mom was using you to take care of her feelings".
It's absolutely true that my parents did care about myself and my brothers well being and wanted to be the parents to us that they didn't have themselves. What they didn't know, and probably still don't, is that you really can't be an effective parent if you haven't dealt with your own wounds. As Bradshaw states "It's unintention and unconscious - the manipulation of children by parents".
As a parent myself i've come to appreciate just how challenging parenthood can be. |
| robbokop |
Posted - 06/24/2005 : 07:01:16
That support group sounds like a good idea! Now I really have to work out what my motivation for still wanting to play piano really is. I practice every day - it can be very lonely and half the time I don't feel like I enjoy it but still make myself do it so I can ACHIEVE my goal. Why do I want to achieve it, for me or for parents(one of whom isn't even here to see me doing the achieving)? This is a very tricky question, I think it's going to take me a long time to work through this and do things for the right reasons - for me. Playing piano was how I first developed RSI, and it stopped me playing for 6 months so that says a lot really. Thank you for your support Hilary. |
| Hilary |
Posted - 06/24/2005 : 06:26:05
quote:
Originally posted by robbokop
I've been recalling some of things my Dad has said to me recently which I didn't even realise were upsetting at the time. For example, 'Imagine you were Michael Owen's Dad, you'd be so proud' - what, so I'm a **** son am I because I don't play football for England. I wonder how he would have liked this in reverse. Also, when I showed him a photo of my girlfriend he said 'is that a good photo of her?' - F**K OFF! I think she's beautiful but obviously she doesn't live up to his standards. After he met her he told me him and my sister had really liked my ex-girlfriend(who left me) and that they'd have to get used to my new one. Thanks a lot. These are just two tiny exampes of a lifetime of put-downs and having to live up to expectations. When I met people as a child he would say things like 'make sure you come across as intelligent and interesting' and I was often forced to perform on the piano for people when I didn't want to - but I did it to make them happy!
Rob, I'm really glad you got the Alice Miller book and that you're benefitting from reading it so much. I had exactly the same reaction and it opened my eyes to a whole world of mistreatment I'd been completely unaware even existed. I found the book hard to read in places because I was so shocked by the cruelty parents inflict on their kids. Your father's comments are typical of those kind of horrible underhand put-downs that are so, so damaging to children. I got quite steamed up reading what he'd said to you, to be honest, probably because I'm so used to this kind of stuff. It is NOT okay to do this to children of ANY age!!
I know it's difficult but I think the fact you're getting angry is absolutely excellent. You wil probably be able to spot things to get angry at your parents for with ever-increasing ease now. I certainly do. Good for us!
Hilary
PS I once thought about starting a support group for people who'd been forced to practise and perform on the piano when they were younger! I didn't know why I resented it SO much then, but I certainly do now.
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| robbokop |
Posted - 06/23/2005 : 04:22:14
'My mother said that I hated it because I was not as tall or as good looking as some of the other girls and therefore did not shine'
Crikey Suz - What a horrible thing for a mother to say!
I've been recalling some of things my Dad has said to me recently which I didn't even realise were upsetting at the time. For example, 'Imagine you were Michael Owen's Dad, you'd be so proud' - what, so I'm a **** son am I because I don't play football for England. I wonder how he would have liked this in reverse. Also, when I showed him a photo of my girlfriend he said 'is that a good photo of her?' - F**K OFF! I think she's beautiful but obviously she doesn't live up to his standards. After he met her he told me him and my sister had really liked my ex-girlfriend(who left me) and that they'd have to get used to my new one. Thanks a lot. These are just two tiny exampes of a lifetime of put-downs and having to live up to expectations. When I met people as a child he would say things like 'make sure you come across as intelligent and interesting' and I was often forced to perform on the piano for people when I didn't want to - but I did it to make them happy!
Until 2 days ago, I thought my early childhood was perfect...and I certainly don't remember standing up for myself or getting angry with my parents about things like this. I just took it on the chin and carried on going like a good little boy.
|
| Laura |
Posted - 06/22/2005 : 15:47:16
Thanks, Miehnesor. Reading your post made me feel better. You make a good point. I'm sure that is why I'm afraid to share my true feelings -- fear of rocking the boat and then being ignored for who knows how long again. I'm just going to go about my business, make the most of my day, and enjoy my summer with my two kids (who are growing up really fast right before my eyes!) I can sit around and dwell on my mother and her neuroses, or go out and enjoy my life with the people who matter to me the most. When my mother is ready to pick up the phone and call me she will.
Laura
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| Suz |
Posted - 06/22/2005 : 14:57:00
Thank you to all of you for your kind words. I should have spoken up more than I did and am now not sure how to handle it. My Aunt (the one who is gossiping) apparently is intending to throw a party for us in England. My mother keeps talking about it. She told me not to tell Jerome about what they are all saying. Now - why on earth would I go to a party with these people???? I have not touched on this but I am definitely going to say no. It will be a nightmare when I do.
Two years ago, I went home for Christmas - I had not seen my cousins or Aunt and Uncle in ages. My mother suddenly pulls out a photo of my fiance (boyfriend at the time) and hands it around the table saying this is my current boyfriend. She did not make it clear that it was a serious relationship. The photo wasn't that flattering of him - he looked sort of heavy (although I think really cute) and my Uncle proceeded to rip him apart - saying "oh no - why on earth are you with someone who looks like this - he looks like he is from the east end of london (lower class reference again) I was so mortified, I burst into tears and left the table - I didn't have time to stay calm. When my Uncle found out it was serious, he was horrified. My mother knew what she was doing. It ruined Christmas day for everyone and was a real shame. My mother told me that obviously the way he looks must bother me otherwise I wouldn't have reacted so strongly.
Honestly, this woman is not right in the head.
I have dealt with this stuff my whole life. My family made me do the debutante season in England (you have to go to all these parties with the "correct"people and be presented to the queen) - I hated it as I thought it was ridiculous. My mother said that I hated it because I was not as tall or as good looking as some of the other girls and therefore did not shine. I just remembered this today. I cannot believe that this is the mother I was dealt with. It is no surprise that I have struggled with self esteem isues. I will say that I feel I have tremendous strength as I often fought back and did my own thing. |
| Stryder |
Posted - 06/22/2005 : 14:01:26
quote:
Originally posted by Laura
I too have a dysfunctional family, with my mother at the top of the dysfunctional family tree.
At least your mother is tops at something ;-) -Stryder |
| miehnesor |
Posted - 06/22/2005 : 13:23:26
quote:
Originally posted by Laura
I know all these things about my mother and still, why can't I realize she is never going to change? Why can't I do, as Dave suggested, and tell her what I think? I've done it before, and they have stopped talking to me (once for over a year). Laura
Laura- What has helped me understand my own behavior is to think about the metaphor of the inner child. It seems to me that you may have answered your own question. You can't say what you really feel to your mom because the little girl inside of you is afraid of what might happen if you do. Perhaps she will abandon you (as before when you did tell her and she stop talking to you for over a year.) Now to an adult that is no big deal. We are not dependent on them as adults. To the child inside of you that is a whole different story.
My own experience has made me realize just how much influence the feelings of my inner child have over my life. By changing my aliance from my parents to my own inner child has given me the conviction to accept my true feelings and push aside the guilt that was previously in charge. Nothing is more important than your own inner feelings. Hope that helps. |
| Laura |
Posted - 06/22/2005 : 11:51:58
Suz,
I second Dave's advice. I read your story and I cannot believe how awful of your mother to treat you that way. What if you did as Dave suggests? I bet it would feel great to say what you truly want to say.
Of course, I'm very good at saying these things but probably not as good at doing them myself. I too have a dysfunctional family, with my mother at the top of the dysfunctional family tree. She is a very self-centered person and has been labeled "narcissistic personality" by my husband's uncle (a shrink) and my husband (who has a psychology degree). When I decided to marry outside my religion (I was raised Methodist and then later Presbyterian, and my husband Jewish) AND convert, my mother went crazy. I can remember when I first met my future husband and how I was head over heels in love with him. My mother, in her typical fashion, tried to ruin everything. I remember her telling me "If you marry him, you will go to hell. I will not see you in Heaven. You really need to think about that." She treated him as if he had horns growing out of his head. She did everything possible to get me to stop dating him. Then, we moved from Michigan out to California, where I converted and we got married. My mother(Dad has no mind of his own - he is the puppet and she pulls all the strings) said "We are giving you $1,000 for your wedding. You abandoned your religion and you abandoned Michigan." That was my punishment. My sister married a Christian man - her wedding was very lavish and beautiful. She is the favorite to this day.
I haven't talked to my mom since they were here for my daughter's June 11th bat mitzvah. I have called now four different times, and every time my father tells me my mother can't talk because she's not feeling well. I don't buy it. I've had the stomach flu for almost a week and I feel horrible, yet I still talk to people on the telephone. For some reason, even though I know she is incapable of acting like a normal, caring human being, I always seem to have hope that she will change. While she was here, I barely saw her. The day they arrived here (they were only here Thursday through Monday morning) they said they were too tired to get together with anyone. We saw them Friday when we went to shoot pictures at our temple, then we went out to dinner, and then to the Shabbat service. Saturday of course was the bat mitzvah. My daughter was flawless, not making even one mistake. It was amazing. The weird thing about this is that when our oldest daughter had her bat mitzvah two and a half years ago, my mother never stopped talking about it. She kept saying to our daughter "I am so impressed that you learned a different language. I just can't get over it. It was amazing." My mother barely said a word to our younger daughter, who was equally amazing. That evening, during the video montage, she was looking around bored to tears, not even paying any attention. Grown men were crying, yet my mother is such a cold fish she could not have cared less. Then, on Sunday, they came over and we were all going to go to the pool, my in-laws included. My mother says "We're going to go shopping at T.J. Maxx (the only store she shops in)." They could not have cared less about spending time with anyone; they just wanted to leave and go shopping. My in-laws (who are very family oriented and would do anything to be with their kids and grandchildren) were appalled. Later, my parents came back to eat but then said they were going to leave to go watch the Pistons basketball game. They make sure everyone knows what's important to them, and it's not us.
I know all these things about my mother and still, why can't I realize she is never going to change? Why can't I do, as Dave suggested, and tell her what I think? I've done it before, and they have stopped talking to me (once for over a year). I'm not supposed to have opinions or thoughts that differ from theirs. I want to call them up and say "What the hell is wrong with you????" but I don't. I suppose if I want to talk to them I have to pick up the phone yet a fifth time and call. Or, I can just go live my life and not worry about them anymore.
I wish you well, Suz, in your future marriage. It sounds like you have a good head on your shoulders. Good luck to you.
Laura
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| Dave |
Posted - 06/22/2005 : 10:21:17
Suz, that's a pretty awful situation. My parents are nothing like that, yet they too refused to accept my decision to marry outside our religion. It was actually the first time in my life I took a stand against them. I actually went months without speaking to them, which was very difficult.
They begrudgingly accepted the situation only once I was engaged and they realized they could not stop it. All along they felt strongly that if they held their ground and protested, that I would cave in, putting their happiness above my own.
Now they act as if none of it ever happened. We have a cordial if not superficial relationship and never speak of their unconscionable actions during that time. Yet this whole situation made me realize that I never had a close emotional relationship with my parents to begin with. If I did, they would never have treated me in such a hurtful fashion, and they would have supported my decisions as an independent adult. But what was more important to them was what other people would think.
I have come to accept that they are who they are and that's just the way it is. They don't know any better. To everyone (including myself) we always seemed to be a close, loving family. But now I realize that the love is there, but the closeness is not. My personality is shaped by the psychological defenses I was forced to build growing up in a family that did not share (or even display) much emotion.
Your family dynamic is clearly different, but I bring this up because it seems that you still let your mother get under your skin despite your newfound realizations about her emotional dysfunction.
What if, instead of "giving up" and hugging her, you told her "No, mom, I will not lower my voice, and I will not take your bigotry. You either accept our relationship or leave right now. I don't want to hear any more of your crap." I'm not suggesting you do that ... but imagine it. How would that feel? |
| Suz |
Posted - 06/22/2005 : 09:23:15
Hey all,
This thread has been so incredibly helpful to me. I have been seeing one of Sarno's psychologists and we have pinpointed my TMS pain coming from deep anger towards my mum. The most important thing in our family has always been to worry and care for her. My father left her when I was 11 (she told us he was a horrible man and father and didn't care about us) - we learnt to hate him and please her. I am the middle child and a strong character and I took on the role of caring for everyone. I was sent away to boarding school and felt very insecure and worried about the family.
I have just gone through a very tough episode with my mother which I felt might be therapeutic to mention here.
I recently got engaged - I live in the states and my family is british, living in England. My mother came out to see me and my sister who also lives here. I grew up learning that the most important thing in my family was to marry into the right "upper class" and to be very successful in careers and looks. Something I never bought into and thought was a terrible way to think - probably part of the reason I moved to the states. Well - my fiancee grew up in the Bronx up until the age of 9 and apparently my family is horrified. This is something out of the 19th century - but this really exists in England. My mother and I were returning from buying my wedding dress - a very exciting and emotional event, and she suddenly started telling me how everyone in England is horrified that I am marrying someone from the Bronx. I don't even think they know where the Bronx is! My mother had met my fiance's mother the night before - she said that she was very taken back that his mother had such a strong accent and has to adjust to know how to deal with this. She said that her twin sister - my Aunt is telling everyone about this. I asked her why she was telling me this gossip and she said it was for my own good so that I would be prepared. I started to get upset and little angry and immediately she told me to stop raising my voice. I sat down in my house and started to cry and she ran over to me and said I must stop as I am too sensitive. I just gave up and hugged her and told her I loved her - according to the psychologist - this is what i have always done - repressed my own hurt and worried about her. I am the parent and she is the small child.
During the weekend, my mother told me that my fiance was "homely" looking and how people would always look at us with surprise as we are such an odd couple. She said it was good that I could get past that and love him. I actually think he is very cute. She said that he has a "common" irish face.
I feel so much anger and rage towards her that I actually hate her right now - she ruins everything. Everyone in the family thinks she is an angel. The pschologist explained to me that she probably has a personality narcissistic disorder - the family has to please her otherwise it is just too unpleasant. She cannot allow anyone to have different feelings to her - it frightens her and makes her angry. When I told her that I thought the class system was a load of crap - she was furious at me.
I feel like I am dealing with such bigotry that it is insane. I know I have to laugh at it and just ignore it but it is so hard when it is your own family. They have set such high standard for me - I was given a good brain and good looks and my family feels that i should be marrying royalty, good looks and wealth. It makes me sick
Sorry this was such a rant but my back pain has returned with a nasty vengeance. It is hard to breathe at night time as it stabs all night -nothing during the day. I stopped seeing the psychologist for a few weeks because of work and I think I might go back to seeing her every week again to get through this |
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